Category talk:Popes by location

This discussion of one or several categories is now closed. Please do not make any edits to this archive.

Category:Foreign countries

This really needs renaming because every country is foreign to somewhere. Maybe "People outside their home country" (although that wouldn't work for the festivals one)? Or maybe we don't need it at all? Auntof6 (talk) 07:22, 30 May 2019 (UTC)

I agree that this isn't okay the way it is, but I'm not sure what the best solution is. We also have several similarly named categories in Category:State visits which aren't in Category:Foreign countries. Possible solutions might inlude Category:People by country of location. But what about Category:Dutch food in foreign countries or Category:Korean culture in foreign countries? Maybe categorized under Category:Globalization or Category:Multiculturalism? - Themightyquill (talk) 11:45, 30 May 2019 (UTC)

Maybe we delete this one and rename subcats to something like "<Foo> by country visited"? "Foo" could be "Popes", a person's name, or whatever. Some subcategories might need corresponding renames. That still wouldn't work for the Japanese festival category, but maybe that one can just be removed from here. --Auntof6 (talk) 13:04, 30 May 2019 (UTC)

Agree with @Auntof6: : foreign to what? Here on Commons we are all foreigners...

@Themightyquill: , interesting solution, but: you can have a [adjective of nationality] culture without a country (a soverign one, I mean), for example Abkhazian culture in foreign countries which would be a non sense, being foreigner everywhere. I would rather suggest, i.e.: Italian culture by country or Italian culture by location . -- SERGIO ^{(aka the Blackcat)} 14:43, 30 May 2019 (UTC)

@Auntof6: The popes category is especially badly named since most popes could be said to come from two countries (one being the Vatican), but is Category:Ioannes Paulus II in Poland in a foreign country or "visiting" Poland? I think Category:Popes by country of location would be much better. @Blackcat: A very good point. - Themightyquill (talk) 09:56, 31 May 2019 (UTC)

It (= this Category-name) all started, <Category:Japanese culture in foreign countries> (= Since 2010 not my creation). --Benzoyl (talk) 05:24, 7 June 2019 (UTC)

How about <Category:Foreign countries> merge to <Category:Foreign relations> ? --Benzoyl (talk) 05:27, 7 June 2019 (UTC)

Besides, I can't tell the difference of <Category:Foreign relations> and <Category:International relations>. what do you think this. --Benzoyl (talk) 05:59, 7 June 2019 (UTC)

• Foreign = Also Simplex, International = Duplex (Bilateral, <International conferences> etc) ? --Benzoyl (talk) 06:35, 7 June 2019 (UTC)
• Also <Category:Multiple countries> and <Category:Foreign countries>.
• <Multiple country relations> = <Foreign relations> = <International relations> ?? --Benzoyl (talk) 04:02, 8 June 2019 (UTC)

Redirect both Category:Foreign countries and Category:Foreign relations into Category:International relations. "Foreign" is an ambiguous matter of perspective. The contents don't need to be renamed with the exception of one already under discussion. - Themightyquill (talk) 08:47, 29 August 2019 (UTC)

	Category:Foreign countries	Delete
	Category:B. R. Ambedkar in foreign countries	Move to/Rename as	Category:B. R. Ambedkar by location
	Category:Dalai Lamas in foreign countries	Move to/Rename as	Category:Dalai Lamas by location
	Category:Foreign relations	Merge into	Category:International relations
	Category:Popes in foreign countries	Move to/Rename as	Category:Popes by location
	'by location' is specific enough for the current content on each of the named subjects here. If someday we also have "subject in non-country location" categories, then perhaps sorting countries into a 'by country of location' category would be warranted. When sorting by country it important to differentiate between 'country of nationality' (where a subject is from or associated with) from 'country of location' (where a subject is located as depicted in a particular file). I think we should not assume that if a subject has a nationality, that is by default also its location. For any particular topic: Category:Topic by location Category:Topic in Belgium Category:Topic in Belgium by nationality (the word nationality may change depending on the subject; e.g. aircraft use 'country of origin') Category:Belgian topic in Belgium Category:French topic in Belgium ... Category:Topic by nationality (the word nationality may change depending on the subject; e.g. aircraft use 'country of origin') Category:Belgian topic Category:Belgian topic by location Category:Belgian topic in Belgium Category:Belgian topic in France ...
	Josh (talk) 23:19, 17 October 2019 (UTC)

@Joshbaumgartner: This looks good to me. -Themightyquill (talk) 12:19, 11 February 2021 (UTC)

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@Auntof6, Blackcat, Themightyquill, and Benzoyl: Closed (several changes, per proposal above, without objection) Josh (talk) 06:22, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

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@Auntof6, Blackcat, Themightyquill, and Benzoyl: While going ahead and making the changes, I came across a little wrinkle. It does seem both Category:Foreign relations and Category:International relations differ, in that the former covers government-to-government affairs while the later covers all international relations including non-state entities. Thus I think instead of simply merging the two, renaming Category:Foreign relations to Category:Intergovernmental relations would be more precise and maintain the distinction. Since this is a minor tweak on the original proposal, I just wanted to ask if there are any objections before I go forward with finishing up this CfD closure. Josh (talk) 06:46, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

@Joshbaumgartner: i tend to agree. By my point of view, foreign relations is a generic name to indicate formal affairs between sovereign countries (ie: a State visit falls into "foreign relations"). International relations is a blanket term in which include, for example, even foreign trade or a sports match between two national teams. -- SERGIO ^{(aka the Blackcat)} 10:23, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

@Joshbaumgartner and Blackcat: That works for me. - Themightyquill (talk) 13:27, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

@Blackcat and Themightyquill: Thanks for the input. Done now. Josh (talk) 08:14, 15 February 2021 (UTC)

@Joshbaumgartner: , ok, thanks :-) I just moved the last piece of conversation before the footer tag. :) -- SERGIO ^{(aka the Blackcat)} 11:12, 16 February 2021 (UTC)