Category talk:Coats of arms of families of Poland
About Polish clans, Polish surnames and Coat of arms[edit]
Caro Giovanni:
I presume you are the author of this proposal: "move|:Category:Coats of arms of families of Poland".
The matter is that there is none Coat of arms from a Polish family.
We got a problem with the translation of the Polish word "Herb" which means, at the same time the Clan and the Coat of arms (the drawing) of this clan. So, Coats of arms belongs to the clans and not to the families. Please, if you have any time, see Polish clans, Polish Heraldry.
As an example: Korwin is not my family's Coat of arms, it is the Clan to which the Szwedowski family belongs, and the Coat of arms (the drawing) used by the clan Korwin. The Polish nobility surnames came from the Renascence, but the Polish nobility clans came from the Middle Ages, even before the Christening of Poland itself. That means we (Szwedowski family) were Korwin time before to use our actual surname (if you believe in the legend...)
As another example: Sapieha is the surname of a well known princely family, but his Clan is Lis and Lis (the fox) is also their Coat of arms. (Even if as princes of the Holly Roman Empire they use nowadays a variation). In Polish Heraldry a Variation is not another Coat of arms, it is just another drawing of the same Coat of arms. In Poland they call it a "odmiana".
So we have a problem with the Category name. We can keep the Category:Coats of arms of families from Poland and add a note at the top explaining all of this, and copy the full Category:Polish nobility coats of arms images, (and later empty and erase this Category). Or keep my work, linking it to the Category:Coats of arms by families, as I did, and empty and erase the other one.
In both cases it is OK for me. Be free to choose what do you prefer.
Best regards my friend. --Gustavo 23:41, 13 mar 2007 (CET)
Polish clans[edit]
My proposal had only to do only with the syntax of the phrase, not with the contents. All other nations have infact: Category:Coats of arms of ..... of NameoftheNation. So if clans and families are two different things in Poland, there should simply be in Commons two Categories: Category:Coats of arms of clans of Poland (which can be a sub-category for Category:Coats of arms of Poland on a par with Category:Coats of arms of families of Poland) and Category:Coats of arms of families of Poland. I must add that coats of arms should be categorized by family, in such a way to include also non-noble families, because in ancient times also bourgeois had coats of arms. Category:Coats of arms of the nobility of Poland can be a sub-catgory within Category:Coats of arms of families of Poland.
Please note: Next time you need to contact me or anyone else about Commons, please use either the messege page in Commons, or write the comment in the appropriate "discussion" page such as this one. I am working at it:wiki very little, in this period. I am duplicating this exchange of messages there anyway. Best wishes. --G.dallorto 11:41, 14 March 2007 (UTC)