File talk:Suzanne Lachelier 2382.jpg

Clearly a derivative of this photo (PD-USGov?) plus something else for the face. Rama removed the template, without stating what sources he used. /Pieter Kuiper (talk) 15:23, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

This drawing is not a derivative of anything and is my sole copyright. I used a variety of photographs to familiarise myself with Lachelier's face and it took me hours to produce this drawing. If you are looking for the cheat that permitted this image, the answer is "work".

The only common point between the image brought up by Kuiper and the present drawing is the uniform, which is a standard uniform of the US military. By Kuiper's standard, all images of US military personel would be derivative from each other. Rama (talk) 16:03, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Do all US Navy uniforms have the camouflage patterns in exactly the same position? /Pieter Kuiper (talk) 16:09, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

What would that have to do with the question of whether File:Suzanne Lachelier 2382.jpg is a derivative of Suzanne-Lachelier-1.jpg? Rama (talk) 16:57, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

I will take that as confirmation that the file on interet-general.info was among the variety of images that you used to make your drawing. I suppose it was your only source for her uniform. Is that image PD-USGov? And please do account for your other sources. /Pieter Kuiper (talk) 17:22, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

You should not take that as a confirmation; actually I do not remember ever seeing this particular image.

I most certainly saw a large number of other images where she wears the camouflaged Navy uniform, I do not even understand why you omnubilate with the notion that a single image should have been the only documentation for her uniform.

I have gathered and examined a large number of images. I do not remember which ones they were exactly and I am not disposed to launch into a futile and unnecessary attempt to reconstruct this information. Rama (talk) 18:53, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

This was not so long ago. If you spent hours on this drawing, it should not be so difficult to remember something. Did you use internet sources or print media? Because sources are just as necessary here as for maps. /Pieter Kuiper (talk) 19:19, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Do you contest that Suzanne Lachelier looks like what I've drawn? Just asking because I find it confusing how the issue seems to slip from "this drawing is a derivative work" from "this information is not sourced". You seem to have pretty much dropped the notion that the drawing is a derivative work, then? Rama (talk) 22:08, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Your drawing was not made from life, it is a derivative work. Problem is that you are unwilling to reveal what files you used, so it is just a bit more work to prove that conclusively. But if the photographer would sue you, I think a court would agree that you used Suzanne-Lachelier-1.jpg. Unless you could remember a different photo, that resembles your drawing even more closely. /Pieter Kuiper (talk) 22:17, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

You really believe that anything not made from life is a derivative work? Wow. Rama (talk) 23:11, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Time for a DR, I think. /Pieter Kuiper (talk) 23:19, 12 June 2010 (UTC)